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I don't know if you remember this,
我不知道你是否还记得，
last time you were here was right before you won the Oscar for the Last King of Scotland.
上次你来这里时，正好是通过《末代独裁》获得奥斯卡最佳男主角前。
Yeah.
是的。
And in a way I feel partly responsible for it.
我感觉我在一定程度上有功。
I can see that.
我知道。
A lucky chum if you will.
我可能是一个幸运伙伴。
I know. Can I rub you?
我知道。我可以摸你吗？
Rub me all you like, Yes, go ahead.
只要你愿意，可以，随便摸。
So it's very good to see you. How's everything going? You doing well?
见到你很高兴，最近怎么样，还好吗？
Everything's going really. I'm really excited.
一切都好。我真的很高兴。
When you have an Oscar, do you -- like will you bring that to the set when you start a new production?
你得奥斯卡后，你在启动一部电影时会不会把奖杯带到现场，
Just to let everybody know what's what?
让每个人都知道你得过奖？
I don't think we talk about that much. It's a nice thing.
我想，我们不会在那个方面聊太多。但得奖是不错的。
Does it give you -- I know a lot of actors feel nervous before they...
得奖是否会让你...我知道很多演员在拍摄前会感到紧张，
on the first day or first week or whatever. Do you have that anymore at all?
在第一天或第一周，你还会感到紧张吗？
You know, I get nervous all the time.
你知道吗？我一直感到紧张。
Honestly, if I don't feel a little nervous,
坦诚地说，如果我一点都不紧张，
I don't think it's going to turn out to be great. You know that?
那么结果可能不会很好，你知道吗？
Interesting.
有趣。
It shows me I'm doing something special, something new, something fresh.
这表明我在做一些特别的、新的，或者新鲜的事，
It makes you work harder when you're nervous or no?
你的紧张状态是否会让你更加努力？
Yeah. I wish I... I thought as the years went by the nerves would go away,
是的，我希望如此，我原以为紧张会随着时间推移而消失，
but sometimes even though I think I figured something out,
但有时，即便我认为我弄清了一些事，
the next time I do something, I'm even more nervous than the time before.
下次我做一些事时，我甚至比以前更紧张。
Have you ever not figured it out?
你是否有一些东西没有弄明白？
Unfortunately, I think I have.
不幸的是，我认为是这样。
You have, yeah.
你是这样。
I have not figured it out.
我还没有弄明白。
You have not, Yes, you have not figured it out.
好吧，你没有弄明白。
Exactly.
的确是这样。
So this character, Bumpy, you play is a real guy --well, was a real guy.
所以你扮演的角色“凸包”是一个真实存在的人。
He's deceased now?
他已经过世了？
Yeah.
是的。
Tell us about this story because it's very interesting.
给我们讲讲这个故事，因为这个故事很有趣。
Bumpy Johnson was -- he ran the mob in Harlem.
凸包·约翰逊是...他掌管着哈莱姆的黑帮。
And they called him bumpy because he had a bump on his head, right?
人们叫他“凸包”是因为他头上有一个包，是吧？
That is true.
是的。
He comes out of Alcatraz, the prison, and he's trying to re-establish himself back in Harlem,
他从恶魔岛监狱出来后，试图重建其在哈莱姆的地位，
as the head of Harlem, as the godfather of Harlem against the Italian mob.
想成为哈莱姆的头目，成为对抗意大利黑帮的哈莱姆教父，
and when we see it we see him meeting, intersecting the civil rights movement and the criminal world.
我们会看到他在电影里逐渐遭遇民权运动和犯罪世界。
because his best friend at that time is Malcolm X,
由于当时他最好的朋友是知名的人权运动人士马尔科姆·X
so we start to try to understand the movement of the community,
所以我们开始试着理解当地的运动，
where he can move his businesses, and different things like that.
他如何自己的业务并处理相关事务。
through his family, how he protects his family.
关于他的家庭，他如何保护家庭。
It's actually quite a great exploration of like trying to understand what it's like to try to achieve the American dream by any means necessary.
对于试着理解不择手段实现美国梦等做出了很大的探索。
Yeah.
是的。
Right. This is a guy -- this is your project.
的确，这个人...这是你的项目。
You're executive producer and star of this project.
你是这个项目的执行制片人，也参加演出。
Is this a guy you knew about for years or did you find out about him shortly before this?
你和这个人认识了多年，还是临时想做的？
I knew about him for years because I'd seen him in films,
我多年前就知道他，因为我看过一些涉及到他的电影。
but I didn't understand the depth of his personality.
当我对他的性格了解不多。
So you'd seen actual footage of him.
所以你看过他的影像。
No. He was very secretive. So I could only find maybe four or five photographs of him.
没有，他非常神秘，所以我只能找到他的四五张照片。
I couldn't find anything to listen to. I was like going by what people told me, by interviews i was doing.
我无法找到音频资料，我就按照人们告诉我的以及我的采访。
Who did you talk to?
你采访了哪些人？
I talked to some of the guys that worked with him.
我采访了那些与他共事的人。
Oh, gangsters?
噢，一些混混？
Yeah.
是的。
Wow!
哇！
I talked to, I talked to...
我和他们交谈...
Old guys now, right?
那些混混都老了吧？
Old gangsters，o.g.s.
老混混。
Right, yeah, like real o.g.s., yeah.
是的，就像真的混混。
Yeah.
不错。
It was Chisholm, Junebug, they both were advising me.
奇肖姆，朱雷布，他们都指点我，
there was a man named Professor Smalls who took over the mosque,when Malcolm left
有一个名叫斯莫尔斯的人在马尔科姆离开后掌管着清真寺，
and he was advising me, I had a lot of different people helping me.
他给我指点，很有很多不同的人帮助我。
it all start really from this guy Makwan Smith,
一切都从马克万·史密斯开始，
Who really had been an associate of the Family, he tried to push this project forward for 18 years.
他过去是其中一员，他在18年的时间里都试图推动这个项目。
I sort of got inside of that and started to push the story forward with him,
我加入其中后，开始和他打造故事，
with these great writers like Chris Mcconnell.
克里斯·麦康奈尔这样的伟大作家也参与其中。
It just started to find itself.
然后故事就顺理成章了。
Did they tell you stories -- obviously they told you things you didn't know.
他们告诉你一些故事？显然，他们告诉你一些你不知道的事。
But stories about themselves that shocked you?
他们的故事让你感到震惊吗？
You know what shocked me was we were talking about the '60s,
你知道吗，让我震惊的是，我们谈论着60年代，
and I was like the best time of their lives.
我感觉那是他们生命中最好的岁月。
They looked at it with such much nostalgia, that it was a moment they could feel themselves,
他们回忆起来有如此多的怀旧，那是他们可以感到自己存在的时刻，
that they knew their strength, their power and they were in control of their lives.
他们知道他们的强势、力量，他们掌管着自己的生命。
It was really interesting.
真的非常有趣。
Yeah.
是的。
To a certain extent I would imagine there is an element of fun to that, being part of something like that.
在一定程度上，我认为作为其中的一部分，是存在乐趣的。
Yeah. I mean it's hard because you know,
是的，这是艰难的，因为你知道，
the show really depicts like the difference between when he's trying to help the community and what he's doing to harm the community.
电影描绘了他试着帮社区与他所做的在伤害社区这两者自己的不同。
So trying to understand these two things about this world and this man,
因此，试着理解这两件事，关于这个世界，他的那些人，
and the people he was dealing with is something the show really touches on.
以及他应对的人，是这部电影真正涉及的。
The soundtrack is getting a lot of attention. Swizz Beats is -- is he your music director?
电影声音获得了大量关注，斯维兹·比慈是你的音乐负责人？
He's the producer.
他是音乐制片人。
he created like I don't know, maybe two songs for every show that we do, actually.
他可能为每一集创作两首歌，我不太清楚。
Every episode, there's two new songs that come out.
每一集，已经有两首新歌了。
because we try to get the music to heal the heartbeat of the day
因为我们想让音乐治愈当时的心跳，
but still like be about the issues of what we were looking at in the show,
同时也与剧中的问题相符，
which is about the opiate crisis, it deals with issues of polarity.
这是关于当时的鸦片危机，涉及到对立的问题。
you know, like of the power struggles between black and white and the have and have nots.
你知道，就像黑人与白人以及贫富之间的斗争。
we tried to deal with so many different issues.
我们试着探讨太多不同的问题。
Black lives matter issues. you know, me too issues.
黑人生命重要性的问题，我也是受害者这类问题。
a lot of things that happen inside of the show,
剧中发生了很多事，
inner working, inner fabric of the emotions of the show.
还有内部关系和情感等。
Swizz beatz, DMX is involved in the music, who else?
斯维兹·比慈、DMX参与音乐制作，还有其他人吗？
DMX, Rick Ross, you've got Dave East, Jidenna, just... buddy.
DMX、里克·罗斯、戴夫·伊斯特、基得内等人。
So a lot of different artists.
所以有大量不同的艺术家。
Yeah, I've been seeing a lot of people write about the soundtrack.
是的，我看到有很多人都在写关于剧中音乐的文章。
谈到经典电影的音乐，我想聊《开放的美国学府》，
Was that the first movie，certainly big movie that you did?
这是你制作的第一部电影吗？
It was.
是的。
It was.
是的。
How old were you when you made that movie?
你做《开放的美国学府》那部电影时多大？
I guess I was 19.
我想大概19岁。
So you were just out of high school. Were you in college at the time?
所以当时你只是高中毕业，当时上大学了吗？
I was in college. Classmates with Ally Sheedy and Eric Stoltz and those guys.
当时上大学了，同学里面有艾丽·西蒂，埃里克·斯托尔兹等人。
Wow! And of course Sean Penn played Spicoli in that.
哇！当然西恩·潘在里面扮演杰夫·斯皮考利。
He was amazing.
他太出色了。
Yeah. He wrecked your car as I recall.
是的，据我回忆，他砸了你的汽车。
What was a young Sean Penn like, working with Sean at that time?
西恩·潘年轻时是什么样子的？你当时和他共事吗？
He was really into the character, like totally, you know he had the method approach.
他完全进入角色中去，他有办法这么做。
So I remember one time he and my brother, the kid played my brother,
我记得有一次，他和我兄弟...，那个人扮演我兄弟，
They were standing right by me having this long discussion about how they were going to steal my bag.
他们就站在我旁边，长时间讨论如何偷我的包。
You know, and I was like, are these guys serious? what's going on?
我当时就想，这些人是认真的吗？发生了什么？
Oh, this is off camera.
这些是电影之外的。
It had nothing to do with anything we were doing.
这与我们当时做的没有任何关系。
I didn't have any scenes with Sean whatsoever.
我没有和西恩演过同一场戏。
They were just going to steal my bag and run.
他们只是想偷我的包，然后跑掉。
Really? Wow! That's pretty crazy.
真的吗？哇！这太疯狂了。
Do you ever go back and look at that movie?
你看过那部电影吗？
I see it sometimes. It plays. It's kind of a classic.
我看过几次，上映过，算是一部经典吧。
I would think so.
我也这么认为。
Did you go back to college after that or did you say all right, well, I'm in the movies now?
之后你继续上大学了吗？或者说觉得没关系，你已经进入影视行业了？
No, you know what? I didn't feel like I was good enough to be on film.
不是这样的，我当时并未感觉我已经足够优秀，可以在电影行业混了。
I did that already, so I wanted to go away, so I actually left Los Angeles.
我已经进入电影行业了，所以我想离开那里，事实上我离开了洛杉矶。
I was in the conservatory here, went up north so I could study some more,
我在这边的学校，去了北边，所以可以学更多东西。
So I could get better at my craft before I got put permanently on film. So its...
所以我可以提高自己的水平，然后一直在电影行业做，所以...
It's great to have you here. Forest Whitaker, everybody.
很高兴你能来到我们的节目，我们一起感谢福里斯特·惠特克。
